anonniemouse: (Default)
anonniemouse ([personal profile] anonniemouse) wrote in [community profile] tf_talk2015-04-16 10:55 am

Gloves Off

Please use this post for discussion of those contentious, murky, triggering issues too complex to discuss/moderate on the main post.

Note that this post is NOT a free-for-all and will still be modded for slurs, namecalling, doxxing and trolling. But fair warning that it will not be moderated for discussion of issues some find triggering (trans issues, mental illness, etc.) and that if you choose to participate here, you do so at your own risk.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 08:57 am (UTC)(link)
SA

I've thought about this some more and this theory also explains why any discussion of his gender systematically ends in transwank. That would be because he set it up to be like this.

As I see it, we have three possibilities:

1. We agree with him that he's male, but because in the real world he was AFAB and lived about two decades as a girl, we have to disagree with his self-identification as cis.

2. We agree with him that he's cis, but, again, because in the real world he was AFAB and lived most of his life as a girl, we have to disagree with his self-ID as male.

3. We respect his self-ID as a cis male, which requires validating his lies and his rewritten history.

We can either defend the truth (he was AFAB, and lived and identified as a girl for about two decades), or disrespect some part or other of his self-ID, because that self-ID is based on a fundamental lie.

No matter what we do, we're the ones who end up looking like assholes, when he's the one who's lying. A typical Andy Catch-22.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 11:50 am (UTC)(link)
Funny how that works, yes?

We agree with him that he's male, but because in the real world he was AFAB and lived about two decades as a girl, we have to disagree with his self-identification as cis.

This one seems to be what most people pick, because even people who agree with Andy calling himself cis are happy to label things "transfail" and defend him as though he they consider him to be trans.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 12:55 pm (UTC)(link)
Honestly it is the insistence on the rewrite that bugs the ever loving out of me.

He use to go on about the past is the past and I am changed but that blew up due to him not changing.

He tried to bribe people in to keeping his dark secret and when that didn't work, he denied reality because reasons.

You don't get total life do overs from the beginning unless you are reincarnated and then the self aware is not these or is there depending on your religious POV.

He wants a clean slate yet again after swearing it is the last time that he will (fill in the blank of something icky he has done).

He hasn't earned that right or the slate.

So there is his head canon and then there is reality which doesn't mesh nor will it ever mesh because he comes off looking bad.

Reminds me of a friend's husband who had to deal with his ex who had created this entire scenario of why they got divorced that made the ex feel better about themselves.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 01:13 pm (UTC)(link)
I would honestly have more sympathy (well, no, not really; I would just have less anger) towards him at this point if he could just be taught to yell "REBOOT" and post that on his blogs before he suddenly rewrites himself.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-07-01 04:52 am (UTC)(link)
"Reboot" is too charitable. I prefer "retconning."

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 03:17 pm (UTC)(link)
On top of all that, he just plain out lies in ways tangentially related to sexuality and gender and any talk about that subject gets labeled transwank, even though it is subtlely rewriting history.

For example, in the previous thread about his exploring homosexuality by fucking some guys: it doesn't matter how he IDs, whether as male or female, AFAB or AMAB, trans or not, it is not what happened. He had a steady boyfriend, then explored his sexuality with a girl, in that order (whether he was straight, lesbian, male, female, again, is irrelevant), and his writing from the time confirms that is what he thought he was doing -- exploring his attraction to a girl. It is not about saying "lesbian" as opposed to "straight man" in retrospect, it is whether his dating history included person a or person b. He likes to label himself as a sort of casanova with an incredible dating history, and it is easy to sneak in sexual experiences here and there (especially during the time he still presented as female), and have people be too afraid to question, did any of that happen?

Or for example, things relating to the Amy Player name: it is not just that it is a name/misgendering issue -- if it were possible I'd rewrite every online name he has ever used to the one he prefers today. It is that he claimed it was his *sister.* He could have said something like: No, Amy Player was a pseudonym, it was me, male Andy Blake all along, but those were still my actions. It is that he said it was a completely different person with their own name and identity that it becomes something that needs calling out. it is no different than calling out that Jordan Wood is Andy Blake and not the soul of Elijah Wood.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 07:31 pm (UTC)(link)
And it was one thing when he blamed it on a non-existent evil twin sister. But last we heard, he was blaming it on his real-life sister. An actual person. People were being yelled at for supposed transphobia for calling that out. Which, hell no. Making up an evil twin is one (hilarious) thing; claiming a real person -- your own SISTER -- did all the horrific things you did is completely another. And not hilarious.

Andy's a misogynistic asswipe who tries to blame women for everything he does, and I'm tired of him getting away with it under a trans shield.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 10:06 pm (UTC)(link)
I also suspect blaming his sister for his abuser had the added bonus (for him) of vilifying her to his friends. Andy really, really does not like his sister, so much so that he dropped his SJW veneer and ranted angrily about her "perpetual bitch attitude" on his tumblr.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 10:06 pm (UTC)(link)
*for his abuse of others, whoops

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 10:30 pm (UTC)(link)
For example, in the previous thread about his exploring homosexuality by fucking some guys: it doesn't matter how he IDs, whether as male or female, AFAB or AMAB, trans or not, it is not what happened. He had a steady boyfriend, then explored his sexuality with a girl, in that order (whether he was straight, lesbian, male, female, again, is irrelevant), and his writing from the time confirms that is what he thought he was doing -- exploring his attraction to a girl.

If he rewrote his own history so that he was born male and always lived as male, so that Amy literally never existed, then obviously, the boyfriend didn't exist either. The boyfriend was Amy's boyfriend, and Amy doesn't exist anymore, thus the boyfriend doesn't exist anymore either.

Another nonnie called this rewriting a "reboot", and that's exactly it: Andy rebooted his own story to one where he was always Andy, and Amy's entire storyline never happened, boyfriend included.

He could have said something like: No, Amy Player was a pseudonym, it was me, male Andy Blake all along, but those were still my actions. It is that he said it was a completely different person with their own name and identity that it becomes something that needs calling out.

In his rebooted world, Amy never existed. Amy *doesn't* exist. All the stuff out there about some "Amy Player" is either lies forged by people who hate him for some unfathomable reason, or cosmic abberrations that have no logical explanation so he's *forced* to invent lies to explain the unexplainable. Either way, it's not his fault that those things happen, and he's certainly not responsible for what this "Amy Player" supposedly did.

This behavior is consistent from an internal point of view. The question is whether he truly believes in his rebooted universe or not.

If he did, he would be textbook delusional: he would have psychosis, and it would show in many other ways. But not only does he show no other sign of psychosis, he also betrays far too often that he's aware that this rebooted universe is not the real universe. For example, if he truly believed Amy Player had never existed, he would not say now that he lied about who she was because he was afraid his friends would abandon him if they knew he's not truly cis. This connection works in the real world to pull on his readers' heartstrings, but it would make no sense in a delusional world where there would be no connection whatsoever between his own body and the claimed existence of a phantom girl. The fact that he made a connection which works in the real world in order to better manipulate his readers, proves that he knows *which* is the real world. He's not delusional; he's only pretending to be.

He doesn't truly believe in his rebooted universe. He only pretends to. He knows it's a lie, but he still insists on it being the ground rule by which to play with him.

TL; DR: the problem with Andy is not that he's getting details of the canon wrong. It's that he's using a completely different canon to begin with. It's something that seems completely absurd since the "canon" we're talking about here is *reality itself*, but to Andy, reality is what *he* decides (as in, chooses very deliberately) is real at any moment. And in his current reality, Amy Player and her boyfriend never existed.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 10:56 pm (UTC)(link)
+10000

It's something that seems completely absurd since the "canon" we're talking about here is *reality itself*, but to Andy, reality is what *he* decides (as in, chooses very deliberately) is real at any moment.

This is consistent with Andy claiming he's cis because "it simply settles peacefully in a place of truth for me regardless of what terms and conditions society tries to impose, and isn’t that how anyone knows their gender?"

http://andythanfiction.tumblr.com/post/87969176057/please-do-not-attach-my-url-or-name-to-this-i

What Andy is actually saying when he claims to be cis is, "I feel my gender assigned at birth aligns with my current gender identity, even though my gender assigned at birth was female and my current gender identity is male."

This is obviously nonsense.

Andy is very different from a trans person who's in deep stealth or presents themselves as cis as a matter of comfort or safety, because he simultaneously calls himself cis and expects all the accommodations trans people receive in SJ circles.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-16 11:33 pm (UTC)(link)
This is consistent with Andy claiming he's cis because "it simply settles peacefully in a place of truth for me regardless of what terms and conditions society tries to impose, and isn’t that how anyone knows their gender?"

Creating trans headcanons for every character is all the rage on Tumblr these days. You have to give it to Andy for originality: he went and rebooted himself as cis instead.

I also admire the way he carefully conflated two different but related concepts to make the above reasoning work. What you quote is true regarding one's gender. We are the gender we feel at peace with, no matter what society says. But Andy wasn't using this argument to defend his *gender*. He was using it to defend his rebooted cisgender identity. He directly conflated "gender" with "cis/trans", and used what applies to the former to manipulate people regarding the latter. That was genius.

Andy is very different from a trans person who's in deep stealth or presents themselves as cis as a matter of comfort or safety,

This I completely agree with.

because he simultaneously calls himself cis and expects all the accommodations trans people receive in SJ circles.

This I don't see it quite that way. Andy has rebooted himself as cis several years ago already, and he profoundly hates and despises everything female. He actually goes out of his way to avoid ever mentioning that he's in any way trans, for example making posts like the one mentioned somewhere else in this comm about how as a man, he doesn't know what it's like to be sexually harrassed, so he supposedly allowed himself to be briefly harrassed by some nerd jerk to get an insight into the situation.

He also made a HUGE deal of "coming out" as trans (but not really really trans still), and only did it to detract people's attention from the FLC accusations. I was impressed at the time by the contrast between the overly dramatic way he presented his coming-out, and the near total absence of reaction from other people to this coming-out: to him, who had long ago rebooted himself as cis, going so far as mentioning the word "trans" was a world-shattering event, but to the rest of us, who'd known all along he was trans, it was a non-event.

So no, I don't think Andy wants "all the accommodations trans people receive in SJ circles". I think what he wants is for people to consider him cis already. To buy into his rebooted universe for good, and to forget he ever was anything but a cis man.

The only times he mentions his almost-but-not-quite trans status are when he needs some quick and strong tactic to detract people's attention from something even worse. Like for example when Jenn revealed that he insisted Amy Player was his RL sister: people were justifiably horrified by that, so presto! He pulled out the trans card. But unless he's pushed into such extreme situations, he never mentions he's trans, and he doesn't want people to remember it.

It's different when it's his friends doing it, though. *They* are allowed to call transphobia at any time to derail any negative conversation going on about him. But I'll bet anything that around him, they have to act like he's fully cis even when it goes against reality and makes no sense, and never, ever mention his being trans in any way.

So basically, I see him as wanting everyone to believe and act as though he's fully cis, but since people won't do that, he may as well indulge in using his trans status as a blunt weapon to quickly get out of troubles when necessary.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-17 12:06 am (UTC)(link)
The only times he mentions his almost-but-not-quite trans status are when he needs some quick and strong tactic to detract people's attention from something even worse. Like for example when Jenn revealed that he insisted Amy Player was his RL sister: people were justifiably horrified by that, so presto! He pulled out the trans card. But unless he's pushed into such extreme situations, he never mentions he's trans, and he doesn't want people to remember it.

This is actually what I meant by "all the accommodations", minus the identity itself. He doesn't bring it up all the time, of course. He only does it when it's convenient for him.

For example, he takes advantage of the fact that people are sympathetic to trans people lying about their pasts (as opposed their gender) because they are terrified of the potential backlash should they be exposed. I would also include in that category the fact that he condemns people for "outing" him, and expects people in-the-know to keep his past and previous identification a secret.

I actually agree with everything else you said, though.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-17 12:47 am (UTC)(link)
And I in return completely agree that he's being disgustingly manipulative when he acts like you describe it here. He knows that it's considered of paramount importance (for very justified reasons) to protect the right of random, anonymous, "normal" trans people to pretend to be cis if they so wish, to hide parts of their past, and to absolutely never, ever out them, so he claims this as a blanket cover to erase his entire past.

Only thing is: Andy Blake is no random, anonymous and certainly not *normal* trans person. In particular, Andy Blake never was in the closet to begin with. He transitioned *very* publicly. If anything, he's possibly better known (as in, more infamous) under his female birth name or his Victoria Bitter female net name, than under any other name!

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-17 02:44 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, I think there's some truth to this. I think I'm an outlier in that I don't have any inherent issue with Andy denying that he's trans. Many of the things he's said about his gender identity make perfect sense to me, in that I think they come from a place of discomfort that is not uncommon among LGBTQ people. But constructing an elaborate narrative where he's never experienced sexism personally? That's weird and calculated. Just... don't comment on it if you don't want to acknowledge that part of your past.

Re: Andy's "I was harassed by an Avengers fanboy" story

(Anonymous) 2015-04-17 02:48 am (UTC)(link)
+1